Hello, everyone! This my first try at creating hanjie. I would be glad to hear your comments.
I like dificult hanjie which make me REALLY think and don't give hints from picture or symmetry. I prefer to solve them with pure logic.
So I've made a program which randomly creates a hanjie, calculates border numbers and gives me only them. Probably in many cases unsolvable hanjies would be created, but I've got a bit of luck and created great hanjie of my first try. It was hard as HELL, but solvable! Since I had to solve it myself without knowing the answer, I can confirm this. Took me more then 8 hours though. It's almost 100% logical. Only at the very end you end up with 8 unfilled squares and 4 dots to place there, at this point there are 4 valid answers. I've just choosen one of them, it should be easy to cycle through 4 answers to find it once you get to this point.
Since it's random, there is no picture, so you have to solve it with pure logic. You'll need to use temporary mode a lot. Also be very carefull to avoid mistakes since it's very difficult to track them back, I had to restart a couple of times because of this. If you need hints, I'll give them. Better ask now before I forget how I solved it, because I'm not going through this NIGHTMARE again! :)
Ok, then. Rather than hints it's more of a walkthrough though.
First mark all squares that are possible to determine without temp mode. Go through every single row and column until you find all. You should notice that for a number of rows and columns if only they contained 1 more dot you could find positions for some of the dots. Later when you confirm some dots or crosses somewhere there it may help to find out more immediately.
Then work in temp mode on upper left corner. Nail down 6-dot horizontal line there paying attention to uppermost row, then next 3-dot line in this row. The uppermost row will be very useful in temp mode later too if you start working from one of its squares since in many cases you can confirm wrong assumptions fast.
Nailing down left part of uppermost row will let you to find some more information, including upper dots in column with 11-dot vertical line which will help you a lot on the bottom. You'll be able to nail down most squares on the bottom line and continue from there for a while working in normal mode on the bottom and left part of the hanjie.
That's it for now. Actually had to start solving it again to write this. I'll continue later if needed. Later in the process of solving it you'll need to use temp mode a lot again.
I still need help. could you please give us a few rows or columns. Oh and a hint for you, press print screen then paste it in word or paint or something, when you have completed it so you don't have to do it again just so you can give us a hint.
Bloggsy88: ok, i'll write more a bit later. I actually have about 10 phases of solution saved in excel from when I initially solved this hanjie. The problem is that the flow of solution is not obvious from them. In particular I should have marked up the squares which I confirmed using temp mode. Well, that taught me to save the whole flow when I try new hanjies. And of course, I have the end result. It's just that I want to give the flow itself as a hint rather than simply giving part of the answer. Since there is no picture I think that the process of solving is what this hanjie is all about.
Ausiuke: Thank you very much for the feedback! I'm very glad that someone actually solved this. I feared that few people would actually be interested enough to finish it. As for the guessing, you are probably right. Now that I think about it, there sure was a lot.
I'll probably continue to generate such hanjies if only for my own amusement. If there are people other than myself interested, I could post them here. Otherwise I probably refrain from it.
Puzzledanita, it seems we are putting different meanings in "logical". By "guessing" we mean using temp mode, right? When we use temp mode we make assumption of some square being dot or cross and try to solve puzzle further from there. If we find contradiction then we get PROOF that our assumption is incorrect. This lets us to determine initial square value. Is this not logic?
But I think that maybe the common meaning of word "logical" on hanjie-star means "can be solved without using temp mode"? If so, I'm sorry for misleading you. But I specially stated in description that this hanjie needs temp mode to warn people that dislike it.
I think that only having multiple valid answers could be taken as not logical since the system will only confirm one of them.
Then again, maybe you mean that choosing squares for which to make assumptions in temp mode is not logical? Well, it certainly would not be fun to do it blindly, but if puzzle doesn't let you "feel" which squares to try wouldn't it be practicaly unsovable?
I think that I can agree that choosing squares for assumptions is not "pure" logic. My wording in the first comment is incorrect then, sorry. But for me this choosing is probably what make solving puzzles interesting. Once I got the basic techniques of hanjie solving I found that puzzles which do not require temp mode are not very fun for me.
Thank you for your comment, Puzzledanita. Actually made me check theoretical base for hanjie solving and think about my interest in hanjies. Can I ask those who read this a question? What is fun for you in solving hanjies? I've been wondering about myself because I usually dislike problems which are too abstract, yet I have fun solving hanjies.
Warlock, i actually enjoy chllenging hanjies, and using some temp mode or educated guessing is normally ok, but spending a couple of hours on one puzzle and not even being rewarded afterwards with a picture (for me, the quality of a picture is quite essential in a hanjie) is somehow... demotivating :-)
Better try creating hanjies yourself or teach your program to generate smth more interesting than a random mess, as it doesn't seem that such puzzles are going to have much success here...
Bloggsy88, here are some more hints. I'm using coordinates. (1,1) is lower left corner, (1,25) - upper left, (25,1) - lower right.
After you work out what you can in normal mode at the begining, the squares to check with temp mode are (25, 25), (2,25), (1, 25) and (10,25). After that via 11-dot vertical line you go to the bottom and work in normal mode. After that to advance from bottom side to the left you'll need to check (1,1) in temp mode. Soon after that (3,9) and (9,8). After checking everything in normal mode again, use temp mode to check (24,25). Once you nail it, you can work in normal for a while and will determine about 75% of the board. From this point you need to switch often to temp mode to nail key squares, but each try should be more or less quick. This will let you fill the rest fo the board but 8 squares. At this point cycle through 4 valid answers to finish.
Too many hints and negative chat, so I probably won't try it. Thanks for the effort, though. I hope you do more that are challenging, but with a picture "reward" at the end.
What a ***! :D I feel really proud to solve this one. It´s the most difficult hanjie I´ve solved... It´s completely logical - well, except last 4 dots (two doubles), therefore no hints. The only badly done thing about this puzzle is a missing image; if it had one, I´d gladly rate it 5*. Still, it fulfilled its purpose - it definetely tested my hanjie-skills :) I like difficult (but logical) hanjies, and this one is a king of them. It is the only one at this webpage, therefore it was something like a Holy Grail for me :D (Nevertheless, I hope there will be no such "follies" any more...) Thank you for this hour of solving (well, the other one was dinner).
PS: If someone else solved this Nightmare and felt necessity of "copying his solution just to get fastest time, please, at least mention your true time :)
WOW! That was hectic! I must agree with Joe, love these sorts of challenges... My true time with a total of about 10mins spent getting a coke, picking a new tv channel etc ;-)
Holy ****. This puzzle really was logical except for the last 4 dots. Finally realized where I had been making the same mistake in my reverse logic. Don't ask for specific hints, b/c it's impossible to give any helpful ones without giving the entire solution. That was a work out! My brain needs a nap!
This my first try at creating hanjie. I would be glad to hear your comments.
I like dificult hanjie which make me REALLY think and don't give hints from picture or symmetry. I prefer to solve them with pure logic.
So I've made a program which randomly creates a hanjie, calculates border numbers and gives me only them. Probably in many cases unsolvable hanjies would be created, but I've got a bit of luck and created great hanjie of my first try. It was hard as HELL, but solvable! Since I had to solve it myself without knowing the answer, I can confirm this. Took me more then 8 hours though. It's almost 100% logical. Only at the very end you end up with 8 unfilled squares and 4 dots to place there, at this point there are 4 valid answers. I've just choosen one of them, it should be easy to cycle through 4 answers to find it once you get to this point.
Since it's random, there is no picture, so you have to solve it with pure logic. You'll need to use temporary mode a lot. Also be very carefull to avoid mistakes since it's very difficult to track them back, I had to restart a couple of times because of this. If you need hints, I'll give them. Better ask now before I forget how I solved it, because I'm not going through this NIGHTMARE again! :)
First mark all squares that are possible to determine without temp mode. Go through every single row and column until you find all. You should notice that for a number of rows and columns if only they contained 1 more dot you could find positions for some of the dots. Later when you confirm some dots or crosses somewhere there it may help to find out more immediately.
Then work in temp mode on upper left corner. Nail down 6-dot horizontal line there paying attention to uppermost row, then next 3-dot line in this row. The uppermost row will be very useful in temp mode later too if you start working from one of its squares since in many cases you can confirm wrong assumptions fast.
Nailing down left part of uppermost row will let you to find some more information, including upper dots in column with 11-dot vertical line which will help you a lot on the bottom. You'll be able to nail down most squares on the bottom line and continue from there for a while working in normal mode on the bottom and left part of the hanjie.
That's it for now. Actually had to start solving it again to write this. I'll continue later if needed. Later in the process of solving it you'll need to use temp mode a lot again.
Ausiuke: Thank you very much for the feedback! I'm very glad that someone actually solved this. I feared that few people would actually be interested enough to finish it. As for the guessing, you are probably right. Now that I think about it, there sure was a lot.
I'll probably continue to generate such hanjies if only for my own amusement. If there are people other than myself interested, I could post them here. Otherwise I probably refrain from it.
But I think that maybe the common meaning of word "logical" on hanjie-star means "can be solved without using temp mode"? If so, I'm sorry for misleading you. But I specially stated in description that this hanjie needs temp mode to warn people that dislike it.
I think that only having multiple valid answers could be taken as not logical since the system will only confirm one of them.
I think that I can agree that choosing squares for assumptions is not "pure" logic. My wording in the first comment is incorrect then, sorry.
But for me this choosing is probably what make solving puzzles interesting. Once I got the basic techniques of hanjie solving I found that puzzles which do not require temp mode are not very fun for me.
Thank you for your comment, Puzzledanita. Actually made me check theoretical base for hanjie solving and think about my interest in hanjies. Can I ask those who read this a question? What is fun for you in solving hanjies? I've been wondering about myself because I usually dislike problems which are too abstract, yet I have fun solving hanjies.
Bloggsy88, here are some more hints. I'm using coordinates. (1,1) is lower left corner, (1,25) - upper left, (25,1) - lower right.
After you work out what you can in normal mode at the begining, the squares to check with temp mode are (25, 25), (2,25), (1, 25) and (10,25). After that via 11-dot vertical line you go to the bottom and work in normal mode. After that to advance from bottom side to the left you'll need to check (1,1) in temp mode. Soon after that (3,9) and (9,8). After checking everything in normal mode again, use temp mode to check (24,25). Once you nail it, you can work in normal for a while and will determine about 75% of the board. From this point you need to switch often to temp mode to nail key squares, but each try should be more or less quick. This will let you fill the rest fo the board but 8 squares. At this point cycle through 4 valid answers to finish.
I feel really proud to solve this one. It´s the most difficult hanjie I´ve solved... It´s completely logical - well, except last 4 dots (two doubles), therefore no hints. The only badly done thing about this puzzle is a missing image; if it had one, I´d gladly rate it 5*. Still, it fulfilled its purpose - it definetely tested my hanjie-skills :)
I like difficult (but logical) hanjies, and this one is a king of them. It is the only one at this webpage, therefore it was something like a Holy Grail for me :D (Nevertheless, I hope there will be no such "follies" any more...)
Thank you for this hour of solving (well, the other one was dinner).
PS: If someone else solved this Nightmare and felt necessity of "copying his solution just to get fastest time, please, at least mention your true time :)
Columns and rows that are easy to solve for one or more squares:
R 1,17,25
C 1,11,24
R2 C8,10,16,19,22,25 ; R4 C1,3,12,14-17,19,21,23
R6 C1,4-5,13,16 ; R12 C3,6,10,14,17,20,22.